…or here…

12 Sep

I have many friends (some close and some not as close and some not as close as once were) who are going to be shocked and appalled that I would put up this link.

The 9/12 Marchers and the Far Right Subversives

Again, I don’t believe that I am anywhere near a position or vantage point where I feel like I could accurately comment on national policy most of the time.  I have heard others argue that  Frank Schaeffer has proven himself to be an untrustworthy narrator of his experience and commentator of current events.   However,  I am convinced that Frank Schaeffer has a much better vantage point from which to accurately perceive and understand and comment on what’s going on with the wackos from the far right that I am hearing about constantly.

And yes; I said wackos.   And I am getting more and more freaked out by them every day.

Please understand:  although I’ve never stated affiliation with any political party, I would have considered myself VERY conservative as recently as 10 years ago.  I voted for GWB…twice! (albeit with great reservations the 2nd time…)  The idea of big government does not excite me.  Ginormous national debt is very troubling to me.

But willful belief in disinformation, proclamation and belligerant support, whether in words or actions, of that disinformation scares me much more.

I don’t think, or at least I don’t know that I know any of these far-right nutjobs that would one day walk into a church on Sunday morning and shoot a man because he provided women with abortions.  But, I am bombarded, it seems like daily, with msgs from friends and acquaintances all around me who are on different altitudes of that same slippery slope.

Birthers in my inbox, various/numerous chain emails about Obama’s “secret muslim faith” or whatever, calls to ban this or that corporation because they support “the gay agenda”, buying up ammo as soon as Obama was elected because they were afraid he was going to take away their guns, warnings of the “death panels” in the health care plan, pulling children from public school because of the fear of indoctrination (when really it’s that they want the children at home so they can be indoctrinated properly),  saying “I just don’t trust the guy…” with no reasoning (other than subliminal racism), hearing statements like: “I’m just surprised he’s even made it this long.  I didn’t think he’d make it a year…”,   ARE YOU FREAKING KIDDING ME???!!!!   (I am so thankful my school didn’t have class the day of the President’s school address and I didn’t have to deal with that BS…)

Just so you know, I am a Christian.  I am a very imperfect follower of Jesus.  But I also believe that all of the things that I just listed (and numerous other things) are NOT Christian and are NOT Godly and are NOT patriotic.  So, quit assuming that I agree with you.

It was one thing when fellow Christians assumed I agreed with them on whether or not it’s ok to read Harry Potter.  This is way scarier.


Posted by on September 12, 2009 in Uncategorized


4 responses to “…or here…

  1. jturner114

    September 12, 2009 at 4:10 pm

    It is interesting to read that you have heard all that crazy stuff personally from people in a face-to-face or e-mail to e-mail sort of way. I am aware of those people and the things they say and believe, but I don’t think I know any of them personally. It occurs to me that I avoid having Christian-type relationships with fellow Christians (other than sitting next to them at church) at all costs. It’s probably not the best strategy, but it is working for me for now.

  2. Trevor

    September 12, 2009 at 5:03 pm

    this is mainly a comment on frank’s blog that you linked to:

    maybe i’m living in a liberal bubble, but “frankly” Frank sounds about as extreme as anyone i’ve ever heard. one gets the impression he has a bone to pick.

    i’m sure there are religious right-wing extremists such as he describes (is James Dobson one? i’ve never heard him sound so extreme. and i have heard him.), but are there really so many as to be so troubling? surely i would have run into one if they were common. Frank implies that there are enough of them to utterly control the GOP, such that bipartisanship, he claims, is a “pipe dream”. in fact, though i grew up in Arkansas attending a Southern Baptist church, everything Frank describes sounds foreign or else grossly exagerated.

    he did get one thing right: those who believe in Satan do say that Satan encourages disbelief in his own existence.

    i believe religious right extremists exist, i just find it hard to believe i need to be much concerned about them destroying America, so much as putting a blot on Jesus’s reputation.

    i also don’t think that all the right-wing nuts are religious nuts. (this in apparent contrast to frank.)

    i also don’t think all the dissenters of current policy are right-wing nuts or unpatriotic. (this in apparent contrast to frank.)

    a comment to shack: you really don’t think there’s a “gay agenda”? clearly there’s as much of a gay agenda as there is an anti-“gay agenda” agenda. ok, in some locales less, but in others more. thus gay marriage, which was (i believe) non-existent a decade ago.

    oh, and probably half the home-schoolers i’ve happened to know live in europe now. and they like it there, the crazy socialists!

  3. shack

    September 12, 2009 at 5:30 pm

    Trevor has made me realize I need to clarify just a couple of things. (He’s good at that. He’s a good thinker.)

    1) I am not completely against home-schooling. It’s just that I rarely (but occasionally) hear of people choosing to home school for (imho) truly legitimate reasons. 90% of the time, the reasons that I hear about are driven by fear and a desire to separate from our society and culture (much like Schaeffer described.) I do not believe home-schooling for these types of reasons are either Christ-like nor ultimately beneficial to children. All believers (even children) are called to be salt and light and are unable to do that (or learn how) if they are barricaded in the “salt-shaker” to use a well-worn metaphor.

    2) In my blog/response to Schaeffer’s article, I tried to say that I don’t believe i encounter far-right extremists in my acquaintances and friends who are decidedly conservative. What freaks me out is how much of extremist/alarmist sentiments I hear from intelligent people on a regular basis. I mean really: Obama’s health care plan establishes “Death Panels” to decide if old people should live or die? That doesn’t even SOUND true and I’ve heard it seriously discussed.

    3) Whereas I am willing to concede that Schaeffer may have a bone to pick, he’s also a person who has met and worked with Dobson (and the like) and am willing to believe that he has a better vantage point of observation that I do into some one like Dobson’s intentions and motivations.

  4. Trevor

    September 13, 2009 at 7:57 pm

    i see and agree in principle with your point about home-schooling vis-a-vis salt and light.

    arguably, however, there may be a time (or age) for home-schooling. certainly there could be other reasons for it. demonstrably (e.g. by the home-schoolers disproportionately excelling in academic competitions) in some cases, some measure of home-schooling results in a better education versus no home-schooling.

    it’s even possible that there are some people who want their kids home-schooled for some reason other than a plot to bash someone’s head in with frank’s “lead pipe”.

    i haven’t heard the death panels seriously discussed, but i heard and believe (though i expect it was exaggerated) the rumor of them being seriously discussed. i agree there seems to be some over-reaction on this, so i can’t really play devil’s advocate on this one. but it is worth mentioning that euthanasia has been seriously discussed by those of pragmatic bent. it is a logical end on the slippery slope of a version of “greater good” philosophy.

    in fact, this is really another topic, but the question of how much should be spent in postponing imminent death is one that has to be faced everyday. it’s similar to questions of safety: if we spent twice as much on roads and automobiles, we could make them safer, and less people would be killed and injured by them. or we could just stop driving altogether. we pay for safety however much we judge to make the risk acceptable.

    but future risk is easier to consider dispassionately than immediate health care questions. what is the appropriate amount to be spent prolonging life to the extent possible? consider that more than half of all medicare money is spent on patients in their final two months of life. it might be possible to shift money around to make people more comfortable in their final days at the cost of a year or two shorter life expectancy for all, or vice versa. that’s the kind of questions that policy-makers have to face.

    as for schaeffer’s bone-picking, regardless of how real the bone is and whether he really has it, he doesn’t need to pick it. if he believes he ought to pick it, he doesn’t need to do it in a vague, ad hominem fashion.


Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: Logo

You are commenting using your account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

%d bloggers like this: